Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5, 2010
Contents
1. 4 0 WPF and ASP NET CRUD screens The Haystack Code Generator for NET will generate entity data and business rule classes for all your SQL Server and Oracle tables views and store procedures Haystack generates ASP NET WPF and Silverlight user controls View Model classes and WCF Service Layer classes for true and tier applications Check out codehaystack com download the user manual and watch the videos from more information on this great product They host a live webcast every two weeks You can sign up at pdsa com webcast and see how Haystack will shorten your development cycle Music Richard Campbell It makes sense with your BI background looking at OData as sort of a new form of ETL You re changing this Carl Franklin use What was the acronym you just Richard Campbell ETL Carl Franklin ETL Richard Campbell Yeah It s Andrew Brust Oh ETL thought you said VPL Visible Panty Lines You completely drove me Richard Campbell Visible Panty Lines Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Andrew Brust That s given where this conversation began Richard Campbell What are you talking about Carl Franklin Are you thinking about that parade conversation we were having earlier Andrew Brust That s my point yeah Richard Campbell ETL my friend Extract Transform and Load Any BI guy knows that Carl Franklin2. We re not BI guys Richard Campbell He is Only you Carl Franklin But the listeners aren t Explain your acronyms Richard Campbell There you go Andrew Brust Extract Transform and Load What really do you mean Richard Campbell What mean is how much work did we do as BI folks when you want to set up a data warehouse This was all about bringing desperate data sources together extracting them from the source transforming them so that you could combine those data together and then loading them into a common sets so that you can analyze them Carl Franklin Oh yeah Richard Campbell And OData turns this on its head Carl Franklin That s essentially what we ve been doing for the last 10 years as NET developers anyway Richard Campbell It s trying to organize data so that we can actually combine it in useful ways Carl Franklin Yup Richard Campbell So the idea that we put in OData feed out there so that anybody you skip the E and T part pretty much just go to the L go load up any data you want Andrew Brust Right But that s an issue It s thatthere s not much transform available and it s all like PowerPivot right now Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust mean there is in that you can create your own formulas and a brand new formula Page 8 of 11 Rocks language called DAC and you could transform formulaically suppose but theres not much opportunity for doing serious data cleanin
3. authorization should be orthogonal issue to the OData service Use whatever security your underlying protocol supplies Andrew Brust Right Carl Franklin In this case it s HTTP in the case of Microsoft stack it s IIS Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Andrew Brust Right Which is why said this is exactly the same thing as the first generation of SOAP Web Service Right Richard Campbell Yeah Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust Sort of like this shrug off like well that s not the point mean security is handled by the protocol we re running on But then came the WS Star standards for making things secure Richard Campbell And we all know how well those went Carl Franklin He means cable Andrew Brust They were there because they needed to be there mean arguably that s what made REST so popular when SOAP got so complicated Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust But for enterprise use they were so absolutely necessary Carl Franklin He means cable as a journalism term Richard Campbell Like telegrams Carl Franklin Yeah like telegrams Andrew Brust Oh oh oh Wow Carl Franklin missed that one Richard Campbell don t know It seems like a stretch to me but okay won t disagree Carl Franklin Well it s certainly you know the metaphor is there as a glue as a way to hook up data from one real dat
4. they build it not as a product but really as a whole code base starter kit for building your own for governments to build their own Open Data platform and that code is completely open source Richard Campbell Interesting Andrew Brust There s a lot of mean you know people outside the Microsoft world may agree that s with cynicism or with skepticism but think there s a lot of selflessness on this think this is you know if you look at OData first of all think the team is very earnest about making it truly open and not having a commercial agenda to it and justreally getting it so that we have something on the internet that can be fully expressive of all relational data and accommodating of all relational data operations and then if you look at OGDI it s just done to help governments get online faster Carl Franklin You know we really haven t talked about Dallas and all the goodness that lie therein on the show before Richard Maybe it s a good time to talk about Project Dallas Andrew what s been your experience with it Maybe you could just lead off with telling everybody what it s all about Andrew Brust In effect it s a way to leverage OData and get your data feeds out there and do it in the Azure infrastructure Carl Franklin Yeah And there are so many feeds that are available within this group of data feeds that will blow your mind that you can just start consuming right now Andrew Brust That s righ
5. to be pretty mean the ability to handle high loads are going to be pretty well correlated to the infrastructure don t know that OData is going to be the issue one way or the other If you re hosting it on your single web server of your DSL line you re probably going to have some issues if you re using Azure infrastructure or for that matter Amazon Web Services There s nothing about OData that marries you to Microsoft stack really then you re going to have better results if understood the question correctly If it didn t please smack me Richard Campbell Yeah Do you think that Daryl Miller s question is about the caching and the querying capabilities This is ultimately an implementation issue don t think anybody is necessarily committed to a given implementation per se So its just a standard This is the same question you would have against SOAP or RSS or anything Andrew Brust a wire protocol Right It s an XML format and Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust That s all it is which is both good and bad but we got to start at that low level and then try and get some consensus around it So apparently Google has something rather similar which is unsurprisingly called G Data and think they re both actually based on the same idea of taking AtomPub and extending it so that you can have in effect a user defined schema that aligns up with the columns and tables and databases or sometimes it s less structured d
6. NE T Rocks The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers With Carl Franklin pinsdin and Richard Campbell a RQ own OE ocs orn HTTP www dotnetrocks com Carl Franklin and Richard Campbell interview experts to bring you insights into NET technology and the state of software development More than just a dry interview show we have fun Original Music Prizes Check out what you ve been missing t j Carl Franklin Richard Campbell Text Transcript of Show 599 Transcription services provided by PWOP Productions Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Our Sponsor telerik HTTP www telerik com The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks Lawrence Ryan NET Rocks Episode 599 with guest Andrew Brust recorded live Sunday June 27 2010 Music Lawrence Ryan This episode is brought to you by Telerik by Haystack and by Franklins NET Training Developers to Work Smarter and now here s Carl and Richard Carl Franklin Carl and Richard here You re listening to the NET Rocks Live Weekend and we re here with Andrew Brust Hi Andrew Andrew Brust guys Good afternoon How are you Carl Franklin Good good good Is the weather is nice and sunny in New York as it is two hours north in New London Connecticut Andrew Brust It s impressively humid outside It s also very very busy because live about five blocks from the
7. That s how independently at Microsoft you can do this Now having said that that s the only example know of a non Microsoft platform doing that but it does at least prove the concept Carl Franklin This portion of NET Rocks is brought to you by our good friends at Telerik We ve been blown away by the uptake in the quick adaption of Silverlight It s no secret though The platform didn t provide for consistent integration with the Web Analytics Services Well not anymore As you might have already heard Microsoft announced the Silverlight Analytics Framework which solves the abovementioned problem But what s also interesting is that Telerik already provides support for the framework Telerik is the first UI components vendor to offer handlers for the Silverlight Analytics Framework Using RadControls for Silverlight you can immediately benefit from the advantages of the platform and start tracking the statistics of your applications You can read details and download the handlers at telerik com silverlight And hey don t Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 forget to thank Telerik for supporting NET Rocks on their Facebook fan page facebook com telerik Music Carl Franklin feel sorry for the NET developer that has to charge with going into some don t know dv2 or some kind of maybe even a non relational database but certainly a non Microsoft
8. a mean this isn t just publish a list of items or something Richard Campbell Yeah Carl Franklin This is a queryable data source Richard Campbell Chops of data yeah Andrew Brust Absolutely And this is where all my little worlds started coming together You guys know I ve sort of been in the developer world for a long time and the BI world for a goodly amount of time but not as long Page 7 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks Richard Campbell Sure Andrew Brust And now there s thing called PowerPivot and it s tying all these things together Carl Franklin Yup Andrew Brust Because PowerPivot is the sort of rich client consumer of OData feeds including Open Government Data Initiative fees and Dallas feeds Basically they let you bring all this data into a model We can talk about what a model really is but right now we ll just call it a model and then eventually push it into Excel and do real analytics on it So not only is the data out there but you can actually start pulling stuff in and breaking crime statistics down by zip code or neighborhood or council districts or economic strata or what have you It becomes very very simple to do that Carl Franklin This portion of NET Rocks is brought to you by the Haystack Code Generator for NET Code Generation on steroids Want more control over your Code Gen You want your code generator to give you Silverlight
9. all city agencies and you may not know but New York City has 30 or 40 Mayoral agencies within its government Richard Campbell Wow Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust think we re the fourth largest or third largest municipal or state and local government where our city government is bigger than most states as is the budget So the idea is that basically every agency needs to publish all of their sort of non secure non privacy related data in raw form That s proposed legislation and think its a great idea but it s something that the council has been working on for over a year So Carl Franklin So it s imperative that these agencies share data and because of that they need to define Open Data protocols Is it about protocols or is it about accessibility Andrew Brust Well it s mostly about accessibility although protocol enters into it and politics enter into it so Google was down there testifying in person Microsoft was not although supposedly they submitted a testimony in writing But Google is very happy to host everything for free which makes sense because then they can crawl it and leverage it It s mostly not about format and not about protocol It s mostly just about the mandate that the agencies must share their data so that really citizens can have a more transparent government and entrepreneurs can have access to the data and create products that add value to it Richard Campbell mean obviously there s some wo
10. anything The perfect Page 3 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks Richard Campbell Right Carl Franklin know SQL Server makes it easy for you to publish data through OData but what about other databases What about Oracle databases What about MySQL What about non relational databases Is that a nightmare waiting to happen Andrew Brust If we re talking about OData specifically there are a couple of ways to think about it mean first of all if you re on the Windows platform in terms of exposing the data then anything that has an enterprise framework provider to it and so far that s mostly in the Microsoft sphere Carl Franklin Uh hmm Andrew Brust But there have been loud rumors that Oracle is coming soon But anything with an EF provider would be exposable Beyond that what the guys have actually done with OData is they ve decoupled it from Windows and from enterprise framework and they basically said here s an open protocol that you can implement natively and actually IBM went ahead and did that with their DataGrid technology They have a DataGrid you know Cloud DataGrid product and basically decided that they would implement their REST interface using OData as the protocol My understanding from talking to folks on the team is that the OData team itself didn t even find out about this until they saw a video about it on YouTube Richard Campbell Ha Andrew Brust
11. ata but you still structure it that way So it would be interesting to see if it will emerge or Page 9 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks live on unpeaceful coexistence or peaceful coexistence Google is definitely proactive in terms of hosting government data and services because actually Google Maps is integrated Like the first time anybody has every done this it s integrated with New York City transit authorities subway map and scheduling data Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust start So they definitely got a head Richard Campbell Well and they disintegrate to be going on the IRC channel around the whole caching side of this so now you get into data variability as to how often is the New York subway schedule going to change can we actually propagate cache items out there well and who does the querying Do you just pull the whole set down and query it locally or do we provide services on the backend to limit the amount of data you re hauling around Andrew Brust the above It s probably going to be all of Richard Campbell Yeah think its all implementation at this point You can choose Andrew Brust It it s an iPhone app bet a lot of the data comes down If it s something more browser base then it will probably be a lot more dynamic Richard Campbell Yeah Andrew Brust But again the good thing about OData it s not just the DOM it s not just the flat
12. ause then somebody has to vet what s the crime and what s a guy with plumbers crack Andrew Brust would have to be That s absolutely true There Carl Franklin Which is a crime but it s not Andrew Brust There would have to be some algorithm like noise reduction Carl Franklin Yeah can t tell with an algorithm Andrew Brust That s true over the phone too right It s just that you don t quite get the same scale Carl Franklin That s right Andrew Brust Sothere s lots of data that think is not controversial mean potholes crime statistics at least are not all kinds of economic data Richard Campbell It still feels like a booby trap you know If you re too casual publishing the stuff you re going to publish something that people are going to decide was sensitive and you re going to be in trouble If you take the time to review it then you ll take a long time to publish the stuff and you re going to be in trouble Like feel for the government in the sense that there s no good way to pull this off you re going to have problems Andrew Brust Well that s the story of being in charge of infrastructure Right Richard Campbell Yeah Andrew Brust Nobody wants to be the person that brought in the new phone system Richard Campbell Because if it works perfectly nobody can tell If it probably doesn t work perfectly then it s all your fault Andrew Brust That s right success is if nobody says
13. birthplace of the Gay Pride Movement and today is Gay Pride Day so there s a big party outside Richard Campbell Nice Andrew Brust Yeah Lots of rainbow flags Carl Franklin abreast Half naked men walking Andrew Brust Walkingabreast Actually haven t seen any of that It s been very Carl Franklin No breasts allowed Sorry Richard Campbell l ve always wanted to be one of two men walking abreast Andrew Brust at this point It s quite a commerce occasion Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust mean you see Budweiser banners applauding Gay Pride Carl Franklin You know I m like Mark Miller want to know where s the parade for guys who want to do it with two girls at the same time Where s my parade Andrew Brust Probably at the other side of the Hudson River I m guessing Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Carl Franklin Can we have a flaming heterosexual parade Is that possible Andrew Brust We could try Carl Franklin All right I m done Richard Campbell Okay Well thanks Thanks so much for calling in Andrew it s been really great Carl Franklin Yeah it s been great Richard Campbell What have you been working on these days my friend Andrew Brust have been working on a collection of stuff My latest passion is to give myself a makeover as a wise guy Richard Campbell Aha Carl Franklin Wow Becau
14. database or a non touchable database and having to implement OData If you have access to tables and what not do you think it would be a fairly straightforward thing to do if you re going to do it yourself Andrew Brust Well think you have to define the premise If you ve got somebody who s a real XML nerd then yeah think it s a fairly straightforward thing to do Carl Franklin that guy Yeah You really have to be Andrew Brust Yeah yeah But you don t have to be a NET developer The point is the OData interface for IBM s DataGrid was not implemented in NET and it need not be because all this is about is pushing the data out in the right AtomPub extended AtomPub format and interpreting the URLs with the query adaptions strong at the end of them the right way Carl Franklin Right Andrew Brust And that s what s so nice about it It s that it really is decoupled from a particular platform Carl Franklin Pete Brown says from Skype The killer app for Open Government Data there s now a public OData feed of all the red light cameras in DC and speed cameras Andrew Brust There s a bunch of District of Columbia data on OGDI There are a couple of federal agencies US federal agencies It s a little bit random but the City of Edmonton in Canada has decided and has implemented their own Open Data service on a GDI So there are real live examples out there Carl Franklin OData is awesome mean can t belie
15. ell Carl Franklin What a great way to do mashups of Andrew Brust Absolutely Richard Campbell Yeah The next generation of mashups totally agree Carl Franklin Yeah that was your think you said that about OData earlier in the day Richard Campbell Yeah Hey Andrew C Fritz on the IRC chat is saying As a software architect on a large multi tenantweb based application my primary concern with OData services is security Carl Franklin Hmm Indeed Richard Campbell Can you speak more about how to handle authentication in OData Andrew Brust was thinking that that question might come up even sooner but here is it now Richard Campbell How did it take so long Andrew Brust Right Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Carl Franklin Because it is an Open Data protocol and you can do CRUD operations Andrew Brust That s right Carl Franklin I m thinking it s IIS Andrew Brust You re thinking Yeah mean it s sort of the same story that SOAP web services where when they first came out which is Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust Right Theres no built in security but it s just HTTP man so use SSL and use HTTPS or use your own schema on the server and you can authenticate people know that the team is working on making that story a lot better and think that s one big reason it hasn t been push out to any
16. file DOM It is XML serialization of live data coming out of the data source Richard Campbell Right Carl Franklin phone Andrew So you have an Android Andrew Brust do do Carl Franklin Andrew Android Andrew Brust have the original droid actually as my phone Richard Campbell Wow The Motorola one Carl Franklin And an iPad Andrew Brust do both Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Carl Franklin You know actually took a fake not fake but non deserved offense to a caller who thought was saying to Charles Petzold You know how come you don t have a Windows Phone You re like the Windows guy You know thought he was calling him out because he had an iPhone or something but really what he meant was how come Microsoft hasn t given you a Windows Phone 7 and misunderstood because l m always getting crap from people who say You re a Microsoft guy Why do you have an iPhone And say Becauseit s a good phone because want a good phone You know loyalty goes so far I m loyal to Microsoft for the things that like like Visual Studio and NET Richard Campbell Well how many iPhones are held by Microsoft employees Carl Franklin They love them Richard Campbell Yeah We re walking around campus a few weeks ago and they ve all got iPhones Carl Franklin Right Andrew Brust Despite the Wall Street Journal artic
17. g on that Richard Campbell This is where you re going to get into whammies because you re going to go grab an OData feed on crime stats and you re going to want to try and match it to some census data on income levels and there s no like set of GIS data there s no like set of time ranges You know the crime stats are given date and the census data is from a given year All of those things become challenging This is where you get into this transform side of the problem I m trying to line things up so that they meet up in a useful way Andrew Brust True Carl Franklin Yeah It s almost like you need to agree on data types all over again Richard Campbell Right Carl Franklin Isnt there astandard organization out there thats trying to define standard types for all kinds of data like this Andrew Brust That would be a good thing Carl Franklin It s not Biztalk org Andrew Brust I m not aware of it but mean you mention the census Right The census have this concept of oh think it s called the census name place So when you hear census data about a town or a village or something like that that s what its called But that entity is not necessarily code terminus with an actual incorporated village or municipality or zip code or postal address All these things are kind of overlapping but not quite align Richard Campbell Yeah Carl Franklin think that was one of the problems that Microsoft had with the me
18. ggest concern is how good the touchscreens are going to be because think Apple has really set the bar there and think the best we can do is meet it If we can exceed it that would be wonderful but can t just imagine that So with all these different OEMs you know are all of them going to meet that standard or not You know worry that some of them won t Richard Campbell can timagine think I said this earlier today can t imagine more than four different Win Phone 7s Just because the spec is so high it s going to be incredibly hard to build a phone that has unique features Andrew Brust That s right and they re not allowing not only is the spec high but they re not allowing OEMs to put their own sort of customize UI on top of them Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust Like the Sense UI from HTC or Auto BLUR from Motorola Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust And as said it keeps coming back to Android because Android does use the exact same OEM model that Microsoft did The only difference and this will sound kind of goof ball but the only difference is Google doesn t actually charge for you to use their operating system Richard Campbell Yes Andrew Brust Other than that its basically the same model Take it do what you will and lets see what happens Android by and large has worked out really really well Richard Campbell Although the app store is chaos and actually taking a give
19. le that basically claims that any Microsoft employee who had one in addition to not getting reimbursed also took a bunch of political sort of heads for it which I think was nonsense Richard Campbell Yeah don t think it s true at all because there are some pretty darn senior people inside of Microsoft with iPhones Andrew Brust Yeah Carl Franklin So is Microsoft capable of pulling off the consumer device too that everybody thinks and hopes that they will Andrew Brust They re definitely capable of it They re also capable of dropping the ball so the question is which way will it go mean its going to be tough because Microsoft is and it always comes back to Android l Il explain what mean in a second but Microsoft is sticking with the motto of working with OEMs which means its not going to control Richard Campbell The phone Andrew Brust The hardware to a micro managerial level They definitely have a very serious set of minimum requirements It s a pretty high bar so think the phones will call less together They ll have a lot in common and the overall quality will be high but it s still not obviously the same degree of control as the Apple has As we have now learned even in Apple s case even when you do have full control guess it can happen like antennas that don t work if Page 10 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks you hold your phone in your left hand My bi
20. n app and running it on a lot of different phones is hard Because there are so many different Android phones sometimes stuff just blows up Andrew Brust Andthere s at least kind of three very prevalent builds of Android out there right Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust There s 2 1 there s 2 2 which is just eking its way out and guess there s still 1 6 and some of the older and cheaper phones What think is really neat about Android is you have this real like flagship phones like the Droid like the Nexus 1 0 like the incredible Sprint Then like we had a babysitter come over last night so we could go to this birthday party was telling you about and she had some 50 Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 LG phone from Verizon that didn t even know existed with the slider keyboard and everything else and running Android and use it for a few minutes It seems really solid so you have some really low end phones too in terms of price points Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust And they ve actually been able to make the OS kind of scale those both ends of the market which I think is like impressive Richard Campbell Uh hmm Music Carl Franklin NET Rocks is recorded and produced by PWOP Productions providing professional audio audio mastering video post production and podcasting services online at www pwop com NET Rocks is a prod
21. om yeah Page 6 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show for NET Developers Rocks d Richard Campbell It s interesting Andrew Brust Yeah Carl Franklin Because Atom is more robust Andrew Brust And remember kind of when RSS went from 1 0 to 2 0 and a bunch of sites also had Atom was scratching my head saying why even bother Carl Franklin Right Andrew Brust And then it turns out the dark horse kind of won You know David Winer might not be so please with that but there it is Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust Really you know the power of standard is in everybody agreeing upon it and using it Carl Franklin Right Richard Campbell And you re exactly right RSS went that way too RSS blew up on its own When it came out so many people implemented it it effectively became the standard It had nothing to do with its quality Andrew Brust Right Richard Campbell It had nothing to do with its feature set It had to do really with its simplicity which comes back to its name Carl Franklin the new cables Jersey Shore says OData is Richard Campbell Tables Carl Franklin Cables in quotes Do you mean like hooking a cable from one thing to another sort of like a virtual cable or are you referring to something specific I m not sure Andrew Brust don t know Yeah maybe it s a hooking stuff together reference Carl Franklin Daryl Miller says Intheory authentication and
22. rk here on the governments side They ve got to decide what is private and what is sensitive and shouldn t be published mean you re talking about every council meeting every kind of meeting and every document produced by government having to bereviewed before it can be published into the system Carl Franklin It sounds like a job for OData Richard Campbell Andthat s what the Open Government Data Initiative or OGDI Is actually based on It s based on OData it s based on Azure Carl Franklin Beautiful Richard Campbell What that means of course is that the data comes out in AtomPub based XML format using a collection of open web standards including REST and HTTP What s nice about it and that a lot of other governments apparently are not Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 really thinking about is that its not just about publishing aesthetic feeds but it provides an API right away so that data can actually be queried and the data can even be updated which makes sense You can imagine the service where people could report crimes online Imagine for example you had an app on your phone that allowed you with a tap of a button to report a crime happening right at that moment and perhaps the GPS in your phone would alert the authorities to your precise location maybe the camera could even enter into it Carl Franklin Well don t know if that would work bec
23. se you re not one would take as a wise guy for a wise guy But guess maybe living in New York you know it s sort of seeping into your soul a little bit the wise guy thing Andrew Brust could hold it back for only so long But yeah I ve been for over a year now writing a column called Redmond Review which I ve been using as a bit of a soapbox on various issues affecting you know now at the API level but affecting Microsoft and Microsoft partners and customers and the whole ecosystem Richard Campbell Sure Andrew Brust And trying to blog a lot more actively too have this secret plan to ask Visual Studio Mag and Redmond Developer News to have their websites carry my blogs also that would be forced to post more often Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust And that has worked out pretty well In this week actually went down to the city council and testified at a hearing on Open Government Data Carl Franklin Open Government Data Richard Campbell What does that mean Carl Franklin OGD for short Andrew Brust Well suppose so Actually Microsoft has a technology called OGDI for short which is the Open Government Data Initiative and that did enter into my testimony but pushed that out until the end so that could focus on more non Page 2 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show Rocks partisan issues if you will But yeah the city councilor is moving to create a law that would have
24. standard organization yet mean that you know the team is well aware that not all Cloud data services will be public Cloud data services Richard Campbell Right Yeah Crime stat is going to be freely available but there are plenty of other things that aren t going to be So how do we it s not just securing it it s also how do we have an effective building engine around it how do we make sure that its used properly Those are fairly tough questions to answer Andrew Brust Absolutely But think the solution that comes out will be robust but its definitely you know it s iterative and the first and second iterations involve the premise that the data is open Most of it though aren t going to accommodate updates and so forth mean you can if thats what you wanted to do but it s sort of an all for nothing premise Carl Franklin Right Andrew Brust that right now Not a roll based premise for Carl Franklin You know its pretty interesting how RSS as a protocol was really utilized by journalists and newspapers magazines blogs that kind of stuff where you ve got these short stories But OData really takes that idea and encapsulates all kinds of data and now you re seeing what we thought we re going to see with RSS which is the widespread adaption of a XML based protocol for exposing sets of data that can be queried over REST Andrew Brust Right and we re seeing it instead based on AtomPub Carl Franklin On At
25. t The idea is to have this be really you know hate to use Microsoft competition s term to define their own offering but this really is sort of an app store for data feeds Right Carl Franklin Yeah Andrew Brust The idea is if you ve got their first of all if you want to make data public fine If you want to charge for it here s the platform to do that ina Page 5 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show Rocks reasonable way without you having to build a bunch of infrastructures yourself So it s the same sort of idea that smaller concerns can get online quickly and can get in front of a really large consuming audience Carl Franklin Here s one right here that just went up 2006 and 2007 Crime in the United States data gov provides extraction of offense arrest and clearance data as well as law enforcement staffing information from the FBI s Uniform Crime Reporting UCR program Andrew Brust Yeah There s a bunch of United Nations data up there too Carl Franklin Right UNESCO statistics info USA business analytics US UK and Canada Andrew Brust Right Carl Franklin And some of these are free and some are not Is that the story Andrew Brust think at the moment because Dallas is still a codename and the project is still in its formative stages had thought actually that for a limited time at least everything is free but eventually there will be commercial subscription concept up there as w
26. tadata problem of WinFS Do you remember they were trying to find come up with metadata specific to different types of files and different pieces of data that you could search on and all that kind of stuff Am dreaming that happened Andrew Brust don t know how you got this back to longhorn from PowerPivot and the census Richard Campbell Wow Carl Franklin Well no But it s all about associating a metadata or having types that are standardized Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Andrew Brust Right Carl Franklin So that you can take globs of data from all sorts of desperate things and hopefully jam some metadata into them or around them that is a standard recognized type Andrew Brust And by the way it scensus designated place not in census name place apologize think there s even the CDP as an acronym for it But yes you re right Standard taxonomies are somewhat a contradiction in terms with a lot of public data right now so it s an issue and probably a good opportunity for entrepreneurial software companies out there who can introduce some solutions to help clean it up in kind of an automated way Carl Franklin And Daryl Miller says from Twitter High traffic websites survive because of caching With OData s highly variable query capability how will OData services handle high load Andrew Brust Wow think the loads are going
27. uction of Franklins NET training developers to work smarter and offering custom onsite classes in Microsoft development technology with expert developers online at www franklins net For more NET Rocks episodes and to subscribe to the podcast feeds go to our website at www dotnetrocks com Page 11 of 11
28. ve how widely it s been adapted in such a short period of time Andrew Brust Well mean my observation is that it has been widely adapted within Microsoft and I m not saying that to be coy mean we all know those two work closely with Microsoft No it s not a monolithic organization All the different product Page 4 of 11 The Internet Audio Talk Show Rocks teams within the company tends to work shall we say independently and the idea that so many of them have standardize on this to me that s a world in miniature right there that is kind of united around something To the outside world it just kind of looks like wow Okay great Microsoft standardized on its own technology A big whoop but it is a big whoop Reporting Services in 2008 R2 can render all of its reports and not just the text data but even the chart data can be rendered as OData all SharePoint list in SharePoint 2010 as you know the table storage in Azure If you didn t know the SQL Azure now when you push your database up there there s literally one checkbox you can check off and it will publish the entire database as a set of OData feeds Carl Franklin So cool Richard Campbell There are external companies Carl Franklin Yeah Richard Campbell External to Microsoft that are supporting OData Carl Franklin Netflix Richard Campbell mean obviously Netflix is doing it but think they ve got a fair bit of Microsoft technology in
29. volved as well but mean I ve been looking at pieces around how IBM s REST engine is working on the OData protocol Andrew Brust Right Richard Campbell So there are other groups out there that are saying this is not a bad thing Isnt Microsoft submitting OData to the internet taskforce or trying to get it and made as a generalized standard not necessarily company specific Andrew Brust Ifthey re doing that wasn t aware of it would expect that they will at some point but that think they wanted to do more with the OData standard and more innovating before they put it through the bureaucratic process of submitting it to a standardorganization My guess is that that s the ultimate goal Richard Campbell Right Andrew Brust But as soon as you do that everything slows down So you really want to get Richard Campbell You want to get as mature and in use as possible Transcription by PWOP Productions http www pwop com Andrew Brust Gets All BI On Us October 5 2010 Carl Franklin And as pointed out by Fritz in the IRC chat room Dallas is really the killer feature of OData Andrew Brust Uh hmm Carl Franklin The killer app Andrew Brust What love also about the OGDI the Open Government Data Initiative is that it wasn t even developed by a team in Redmond It was actually the field developer and platform evangelism group that is dedicated to the US public sector They re the guys who build it and
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